Every entrepreneur knows what it means to chase something nobody else can see yet \u2014 there\u2019s self-doubt, exhaustion, and long stretches where the only result you\u2019re seeing is money going out the door. But still, you press on.<\/p>\n
That pursuit is at the heart of Neptune\u2019s Fortune: The Billion-Dollar Shipwreck and the Ghosts of the Spanish Empire<\/em><\/a>, historian Julian Sancton<\/a>\u2019s account of one man\u2019s relentless hunt for a legendary sunken Spanish galleon.\u00a0<\/p>\n The book, named one of Barnes & Noble\u2019s Best Books of 2026<\/a>, tells the story of the San Jos\u00e9, a Spanish galleon loaded with gold and silver that sank off the coast of Colombia in 1708 during a battle with a British squadron. Centuries later, Roger Dooley, a mostly self-taught underwater archaeologist born in New Jersey and raised in Cuba, dove deeply into Spanish archives, found maps that pointed where nobody else was looking, rounded up his own investors and, in 2015, located the wreck 2,000 feet below the surface. His reward? Getting left out of Colombia\u2019s national celebration and an avalanche of lawsuits that have stalled efforts to raise the ship.<\/p>\n This incredible adventure story, Sancton\u2019s follow-up to his New York Times<\/em> bestselling book Madhouse at the End of the Earth<\/em><\/a>, <\/em>is a must-read for anyone who has chased a big idea and refused to take no for an answer. I spoke with the author about the book and the countless hours of work that went into writing it, which, as it turns out, has a lot in common with treasure hunting. Here are some highlights of our conversation, edited for length.<\/p>\n Writing a book like this takes years and untold hours of research. Where did it all start?<\/strong> So I got it commissioned as an article with my former employer, Vanity Fair<\/em>. I had another story I was working on at the same time, and I kind of A\/B tested it. I\u2019m speaking to Entrepreneur<\/em> now, so that\u2019s a close analogy to how you road test two products and realize which one is more viable. In writing that article, I discovered my main character, Roger Dooley, who I had really no idea about when I started reporting. People were trying to present him as the villain. And I realized that, no, he was far, far from the villain. He was the person without whom we would not be discussing the San Jos\u00e9. I knew that the article just skimmed the surface, and went ahead with the book.<\/p>\n Dan Bova: You describe a scene where Dooley is looking for clues to the sunken ship\u2019s location in an archive that has no discernible organization, and he stumbles onto a map with markings that tell him, \u201cIt\u2019s here!\u201d As a historian, do you have those moments?\u00a0<\/strong> Dooley pitched the search for the San Jos\u00e9 to financial backers and government officials, got yeses, then things fell apart, and he had to start over again. Multiple times. Did that teach you anything?<\/strong> Subscribe to How Success Happens podcast: Apple<\/a>\u00a0|\u00a0Spotify<\/a>\u00a0|\u00a0YouTube<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n While examining the sea floor, I loved the mindset about why it was good not to find anything. Can you explain that way of thinking?<\/strong> By the end of the spring, they hadn\u2019t found anything, and the Colombian authorities were starting to get impatient. But one of his investors, who you would have expected would be upset by this news, was not upset at all. He said something cryptic like, \u201cThe remaining 50% is 100%.\u201d<\/p>\n The idea is that when you\u2019re surveying an area, not finding something is determining where it isn\u2019t, and that is very helpful, because it reduces the amount to be searched. But that implies that your research is correct. Not finding something sometimes just also means not finding it.<\/p>\n At Entrepreneur<\/em>, we talk a lot about imposter syndrome. Dooley seems like the polar opposite. This man was utterly convinced he was the man for the mission, despite not having \u201cofficial\u201d qualifications and training. What lessons did you learn from him?<\/strong> As eccentric as he is, his drive and his motivation are infectious. He learned valuable lessons working in the film industry in Cuba, and he understood the value of showmanship and presentation and narrative. He created these amazing presentations. He understands the value of a colorful, exciting deck, and that is probably more effective than some exhaustively researched survey.<\/p>\n As you said before, Dooley has been villainized as a \u201ctreasure hunter,\u201d which I never really thought of as a derogatory term.<\/strong> Subscribe to the\u00a0How Success Happens newsletter<\/a>\u00a0for weekly inspiration.<\/strong><\/p>\n Legal battles continue over ownership of the shipwreck and its treasure. What do you think would be the fairest outcome?<\/strong> And for the treasure, I mean not just the gold and silver and emeralds, but all the contents \u2014 this should be preserved and available for study and admiration for the public and academia. There is no other Spanish galleon from this era that has been rigorously and ethically excavated.\u00a0<\/p>\n We both live in Westchester. Say you\u2019re kayaking around the Long Island Sound and you tip over and you hit your head on a sunken treasure. Do you report it?<\/strong> Every entrepreneur knows what it means to chase something nobody else can see yet \u2014 there\u2019s self-doubt, exhaustion, and long stretches where the only result you\u2019re seeing is money going out the door. But still, you press on.<\/p>\n That pursuit is at the heart of Neptune\u2019s Fortune: The Billion-Dollar Shipwreck and the Ghosts of the Spanish Empire<\/em><\/a>, historian Julian Sancton<\/a>\u2019s account of one man\u2019s relentless hunt for a legendary sunken Spanish galleon.\u00a0<\/p>\n
After Madhouse at the End of the Earth, <\/em>I was looking for my second book, and I didn\u2019t want to be pigeonholed as a writer of harrowing nautical stories. But there was one story that would not let me go. I remembered this almost fairy-tale-like headline about a sunken galleon containing billions of dollars\u2019 worth of gold and silver. But I really didn\u2019t know the story yet. I had no expertise.<\/p>\n
Julian Sancton:<\/strong> Absolutely. I spend a lot of time diving into archives without really knowing what I\u2019m going to find in there \u2014 those archives are the equivalent of an ocean for me. And when you find something that can make the facts come alive, those are nuggets of gold. With Madhouse<\/em>, one of the characters who dies early on is this Norwegian deckhand. While talking to archivists who talk to other archivists, his diary popped up. And it gave all kinds of details and poignant observations about life on that boat. Those finds are the equivalent of Roger Dooley chancing on this critical map, which led him to shift his search area to an area that nobody else was looking at.<\/p>\n
Well, perseverance. Push, push, push. He is absolutely relentless, even now in his 80s. Since the book was published, he\u2019s been giving me advice on how to promote it. He\u2019s saying, \u201cYou need to get it in this store and that hand. I went to the Barnes & Noble the other day \u2014 it wasn\u2019t even there. You gotta talk to them!\u201d And by the way, I\u2019m proud to inform you that Barnes & Noble selected the book as one of their best books of 2026, so maybe Roger\u2019s sending good vibes out there.<\/p>\n
They broke Roger\u2019s search area into sections that could be surveyed using a tried-and-true technique of all surveyors and treasure hunters, which is called \u201cmowing the lawn.\u201d It involves methodically going over an area strip by strip.<\/p>\n![\"\"](\"https:\/\/www.entrepreneur.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/2\/2026\/11\/44_Sanc_9780593594179_all_art_r1.jpg?w=1024\")
Dooley believes very much that he has a seat at the table. He never thinks that he\u2019s an imposter, even though many people think that he is. He\u2019s kind of a fake it till you make it guy. In Cuba, he invented the field of maritime archaeology. Did not wait to have a degree in it. He created his own course of study. Because nobody else was cataloging the wrecks around Cuba, he started doing it himself, and then he became the de facto authority.<\/p>\n
I think it\u2019s easy to villainize treasure hunters. But I think their entrepreneurial spirit is actually quite admirable. Treasure hunters like Mel Fisher, Kip Wagner, or Bert Webber embody a kind of quintessential American entrepreneurship. It\u2019s literal venture capitalism. You\u2019re out there taking a massive risk. Frequently, you\u2019re not the one putting down the money, but you\u2019re convincing capitalists of the value of what you\u2019re doing. They\u2019re investing not just because they\u2019re gonna get a huge return on investment if they find something, but because they wanna be involved in something grand. And I think if it weren\u2019t for the adventurism of treasure hunters, a lot of these wouldn\u2019t be found at all.<\/p>\n
I am in the position of having no horse in the race and just observing this as a writer, as ultimately a romantic. But what I would like to see happen is some kind of international collaboration between the stakeholders in Spain, in Colombia, in the UK. I would love to see a rigorous academic excavation and some kind of museum that would involve Roger as a principal architect. He deserves that not only because of his past accomplishments, but because he knows more about the San Jos\u00e9 than anybody on earth.<\/p>\n
Of course!\u2026 Well, how big is this treasure? [Laughs]<\/em><\/p>\n![\"\"](\"https:\/\/www.entrepreneur.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/2\/2026\/11\/Julian-Sancton-author-photo-by-Jess-Levine.jpg?w=1024\")